More Verizon and Debt Collection

I've written in the past about Verizon and their debt collection practices. They're back again.

I got a call this morning about an old disputed cell phone bill. The caller said she was from NES. I'm thinking this is Nintendo calling trying to sell me a Wii, but no. NES stood for something else, National something Systems?

So she tells me this is about my "debt" of $473. She tries to intimidate me by telling me my social security number and asking me if it's correct. I refused to answer that one of course. Then she tells me she knows I'm self-employed. I'm not sure what that has to do with anything. All of this, of course, in a nasty tone.

Meanwhile I'm laughing throughout the call. I asked her how old this debt was. She answers "2001". So it gets even funnier for me, since the statute of limitations on breach of contract is 6 years. I suppose I should find these calls scary but it's really just pathetic.

The underlying story is this: I switched from Verizon Wireless to Sprint because I wanted a Palm Treo smartphone and Verizon didn't sell it. Verizon sends me a bill for my monthly usage (about $130), and two termination fees of $170 each. I figured I was responsible for "a" termination fee, not termination fees. I called Verizon to try to resolve the issue. They said the fee was per line, and we had two lines.

Well, I didn't agree to pay two termination fees. I only agreed to pay "a" termination fee. I asked her to send me proof that I'd agreed to this. She mailed me something that said "a termination fee may apply" in big bold print on the front, and I did see that in a microfont on the back it said "per line."

I didn't think that was fair and said I'd pay the $300 I owed but I refused to pay the extra $170. Verizon refused to accept my $300. Okay.

It's been over six years now and they can't get over it. At this point, of course, I wouldn't pay a dollar to get rid of this. I was willing to pay what was fair back then, but after six years of harassment I'm not paying anything. I suppose it should be annoying me but instead it's just too darn funny.

What's really wrong about this is that they do it to regular people who don't know enough to laugh off the calls.

A good debtor-creditor experience

I've complained in the past about some annoying experiences with debt collection, particularly the Yellow Pages companies. I was starting to have what seemed like a similar experience, but then things changed.

In 2004 I agreed to do a free trial of a listing on lawyers -dot- com. Then I got a bill. I refused to pay and sent a letter in February of 2006. I'd get a letter or bill every once in a while, but nothing too bothersome and I ignored it.

Several months ago we switched our online legal research service from Westlaw to Lexis. Lexis owns lawyers -dot- com. I told my sales rep about the issue and was told it would be taken care of. It wasn't, but I still wasn't worried about it.

Then today I got a threatening letter delivered express mail. Now this didn't worry me, but it did make me angry. I sent an e-mail to my replacement sales rep at Lexis and also a firmly worded letter to the person who had written that letter.

Within a few hours I got a call from a Lexis manager. He apologized and assured me the disputed account had been cleared. He even followed up with an e-mail. I was very impressed and have to say that this experience added significant loyalty for me to Lexis. They were confronted with a challenging customer service moment and they rose to the challenge.

Verizon idiots and debt collection, redux

See update at bottom of this post
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I posted more than a year ago about problems we had with Verizon mistakes and their debt collection practices. Like Poltergeist, they're back!

Before getting into this, I should also mention a more recent post I did about debt collectors.

Briefly on the older Verizon story, a long time ago in a galaxy not so far away, Verizon misspelled my name and used the wrong phone number in my yellow pages listing. To be specific, they spelled my name correctly once and incorrectly once within a couple lines of each other, and used my cell phone number in my ad instead of my toll-free number. So I made phone calls, sent letters, got no response and refused to pay. I was harassed by debt collectors for a while, and then they just dropped it.

And then they printed the ad again the next year -- still wrong. So they sent me bills and I ignored them. Eventually they started sending me threatening notices and I ignored those. Now there's some collection agency that calls me, usually at home but sometimes on my toll-free number.

As in the old debt collectors post, these debt collectors pretend to be interested in the story, and claim they're going to investigate. The other day one of them called me to tell me that I'm wrong about the ad (I have it in my office, so I know I'm not wrong about it). Then today someone else from that debt collector called. I told him I was tired of talking to his firm and was not interested in talking any more. I'm not paying. Go ahead and sue me. For $252, I just don't think that's likely.

And then he used the classic debt collector's line -- "We'll have to report this on your credit." Well oh me, oh my, dearest me. We've managed to make payments consistently on our mortgage, our home equity line of credit, our credit cards, and so on, for close to a decade. And I'm supposed to worry about a $252 report on my credit? I don't think so.

But why did he make that threat? Because it actually scares some people. People who aren't sophisticated. People who might actually need to borrow money at some point in the near future. But let's analyze this threat a bit further. It's probably been a year since I refused to pay this. It probably went on my credit report several months ago already. It's an empty threat because it was already reported on my credit.

I stand by the comment in my previous post. I used to wonder where felons find jobs after they get out of prison. Now I know. They work in the debt collection industry. So remember this before you buy anything from Verizon. They treat their customers like dirt, and if there's ever a dispute, whether or not they're right, they will turn you over to the wolves. Sadly, many other businesses seem to be about the same.
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Update - Since this post I did another one in December of 2008: More Verizon and Debt Collection.

Now this letter came in June of 2009:

Looks like my "debt" has been passed off to yet another bottom feeder. And they got my address wrong to boot.

Verizon - disputes and collection

Not too long ago I did a post on volume businesses. This morning I got a phone call that tweaked that funny bone.

I have a dispute running right now with Verizon about my Yellow Pages advertising bill. In one of the local books they misspelled my name in the ad, and listed the wrong phone number. I sent them a letter before publication telling them to stop, and they published it anyway. After getting billed I sent them a letter refusing to pay unless someone called to discuss my account with me. Verizon did not respond to either letter. I tried calling but you go through 8 layers of voice-jail and eventually get to a person who is in the wrong department.

I had a similar problem with Verizon Wireless maybe a year ago. I switched to Sprint PCS from Verizon Wireless. I expected to pay a termination fee of $170, along with my bill of about $130. They tried to sock me for a second termination fee because I had two lines. I refused to pay for the 2nd termination fee and offered to pay the $300. They refused. I documented the dispute by sending them letters.

Every once in a while I would get a call from some collection agency. I would refuse to pay, tell them to sue me, and most of all, tell them not to call me again. They would shift it to another collection agency, which would call me once and I'd do the same thing. Eventually I got a credit report for some other reason, and saw that Verizon had marked my account as a write-off. I still got a couple calls from collection agencies and told them I knew it was a write-off, and to try some other sucker. Bottom line - I ended up not even paying them the $300 I agreed that I owed them. Their volume business practices cost them $300.

Now my dispute with the yellow pages is about $600 total, and it goes up every month. I'd probably agree to pay half to resolve the dispute, but I can't get anyone on the phone. So today I get a call from a collection agency. Of course that person isn't in a position to negotiate for my future billing, so that call went nowhere. I see us going down the same path again. And if they do actually sue me, I'm ready for them.

Now just imagine if they bothered to have a person answer their phone, or at least have someone call me after I send them a letter. How much money would they save, and how much better their public image might be. Because I'm sure I'm not the only one. Their was a fairly big story locally a couple years ago when they left 8000 businesses out of the yellow pages by mistakes.

Reminds me of an old Saturday Night Live bit - We're Verizon - We Don't Have to Care. (It was Exxon in the SNL bit).

For some other attacks on Verizon, see:

2003 gripe about Verizon DSL
Garrett Murray's gripes